Episode #27: Mark Yoshino

Mark Yoshino has led the Bellevue College Bulldogs baseball squad for 31 years, 26 of those years as the Head Coach.  He is the winningest coach in Bellevue Baseball's storied history.  He has helped over 200 young men move on to the 4-year college ranks, and he's seen a very impressive 38 of his players get drafted into the professional ranks.

We had a great conversation about coaching, college and professional baseball and recruiting.  Enjoy!

Learn more about Mark Yoshino here:  https://www.bellevuecollege.edu/athletics/sports/baseball/coaches/

Transcript

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Welcome back to the Significant Coaching Podcast. I'm coach Matt Rogers. On this episode of the Significant Coaching Podcast, I sat down with Mark Yoshino, the co head baseball coach at Bellevue College in Bellevue, Washington. And for those of you that don't know, Bellevue is located a few miles east of Seattle and enrolls a massive 36, 000 students each year. Coach Yoshino has coached the Bulldogs for 30 years. 31 years where he's helped over 200 baseball players move on to four year colleges and 38 of those young men went on to be drafted by professional teams including a former Chicago Cub and my favorite team Adrian Sampson. Adrian had some good years for the Cubbies. Of pitching as well as any baseball skipper in the country, but I picked his brain on all things coaching, baseball, and recruiting. It was a fun conversation with a significant leader and a really good man. Enjoy. Hey coach, thanks for joining me today. How are you feeling? Good, plus summer's almost gone. with all the activities in the summer and the recruiting, which is getting earlier and earlier as the teams change. When do you start recruiting the next class? For junior college, times have changed. So we're already halfway done with 2025 class. Five years ago, we were probably just getting started and doing visits into the wintertime. That's great. Nowadays, it's there's even players a year in advance that are making commitments to junior colleges, which is unheard of. I love it years ago. So yeah, moving up faster and faster. I'm a analytics guy to some level, and I really wanted you on to talk analytics a little bit. For a lot of people it's become a big part of how they evaluate kids, especially at the major league level, how, they draft, how they promote, how they make trades. but to talk a little bit about launching. this is George Brett, Probably a week or two ago talking about launch angle. I just wanted to get your thoughts on it. So I'll play it for you. Launch angle to me is if I'm swinging up, coming here and the ball hits, that's the launching, if it hits on the bottom part of that, it's a grounder. If it's hits in the middle of that, it's a line drive. But my bat's still coming through the zone on the same plane as the ball. And that's why I didn't strike out a lot. nowadays, players strike out all the time because I think their bat is in and out of the zone the same plane as the ball for just a short period of time. How do you feel about that? One of the greatest hitters of all time. How do you feel about that when you hear that? And there's not a lot of hitters that really hit like him, nowadays. I remember he was a flat plane. Barrel guy, one handed finish type which was the big fad back in the early 2000s when Albert Pujols. Was the guy now everyone's copying the Otani and J Rod swing. it's funny how trends come and go. It's just funny. I see it at recruiting events and showcase how everyone has the same kind of swing. Funny how all the recruits, not all, but a lot of them have the same kind of swing now. That you see on TV. And then I remember going to a showcase back in 2010 and everyone had the one handed high finish, like Albert Pujols and you don't see one guy like that. Now. And it's just, I was thinking of George Brett because I watched him when I was a kid, and like I said, this flat barrel, on the back, no 45 tilt, but straight line drive, solid contact. and I can't think of one college player at any level, Division I down, or any high school recruit I've seen, who even looks like George Brett, as far as this. stance in the plate approach or swing, Isn't that a shame? Comical in some ways but sad in some ways because you're one of the best hitters Of all time things come and go, with training methods and whatnot. It's almost yoga and Pilates, which has been around for centuries, then they all come back as big fads and it's interesting. So what's, your approach when you bring a recruit in, terms of. Adapting their swing, changing their swing. If they're hitting, leave them alone. What's your approach with hitting? The other coach with me handles the hitters, but I, see what he does a lot and there's not a whole lot of drastic changes. our levels are a delicate balance because they need to produce, in order to go somewhere. if you get too crazy with things. Yeah, I can go the other way. We're also a two year school and we're also getting a lot of transfers back from four year schools because of the transfer portal that are coming back to our level, but they're only with us for one year. So our window is a lot different than a four year school that might have a guy for four years. the teaching approach needs to be a little bit different because like I said, the window is just a whole lot shorter. I don't know how you do it. I'm always impressed with two year coaches for me when I was a college coach. That first year, if I could get anything out of a freshman, I assumed it was going to take 12 to 15 months to really get them to the point where they could consistently contribute, understand the physicality, the speed, all those things that come into it, you don't have that time. you've got to get freshman producing right out of the gates. Are you looking for that kid? That's a little bit more polished. we're going over that now with recruits. at the junior college level. A lot of it is development projection. I was actually just talking about it this morning with another person we've got some players coming in that have tremendous tools, as far as bat speed, running speed, big, strong, but Odds of productivity, not so sure the first year they've got a long ways to go. And then others that, are just great performers put up numbers as far as batting average clutch hits, but aren't probably the most attractive guy as far as physical tools or potential down the road. they're just going to be good junior college players. just getting a balance between those two. It is tough because you don't have a crystal ball to know who's going to really make a jump, in one year or two. I was actually just talking about a couple pitchers. that we had make big jumps last year, just as far as their contributions and their ability to play college baseball. they weren't the two guys most of the players on the team thought we're gonna make the big jumps, but they ended up doing it. no one has a crystal ball to predict all that stuff. especially at the junior college level, it's tough because you need at least nine in the lineup and at least four starters, on the mound your crystal ball is pretty good considering you've had 15 kids signed professionally in the last 25 years. Yeah. one's holding on in AAA right now. he came back and spoke to the team over December. Who's that local guy, Adrian Sampson. You had a nice run with the cubs. Yeah. He's a round rock now in the random organization. So yeah, signed out of our place in 2012. So it's been a 12 year career. That's great. And it's just for longevity for a pitcher. he's, one of those. guys, it seems like he's always ready to pitch, ready to throw some long innings, ready to start. that's, really impressive. Talk to me, about evaluating pitchers. What, are a couple of things that you're looking for when you're watching 17, 18 year olds in high school? So for me it's a little different than most college coaches, because of the development aspect. I'm looking for the tweener guy. the tools and the velocity it's, okay, but they have to have some ability to throw strikes compete and do well, knowing who's going to be able to contribute that first year in college. And so for me, I'm not necessarily looking for the 90 mile an hour guy, but maybe just a mid eighties thrower who can project to throw harder down the road. At the same time can compete in the zone and, contribute. Cause like you were saying, it's a, you need at least four stars and four relievers. And so 12, 15 pitchers, that's over half of them that have to get it done as a freshman. It's almost impossible to run a college program without at least 12 to 15 pitchers, isn't it? we're seeing a rise in the injuries as well, guys coming into the program. just the times of today. Kind of what you're hearing in MLB, the increasing number of injuries. It's meshing with guys throwing harder and going all out. I think it was Verlander who did a public interview on the number of injuries and how guys are just maxing out. This is the way it is in this era. we're seeing it too at our level, how cautious are you guys with pitch counts? Is there a number? Yeah, we're on the low side. I was just telling someone this morning where the starters probably did a little upset with us over it. Cause we go slow with just about three innings and the preseason three to four. That's it. So what do you build them up? We stay there for about a month. Do you really? That's right. Yeah. we start in mid February, which is borderline ridiculous because we're not hopping on a plane to go to Scottsdale, Arizona, like most of the division one programs, right? up north and we don't have the budget to do that. And so we're planning 35 degree weather down at Tacoma, Washington on after turf where the turf is half frozen as well, trying to copy the D ones. Yeah. By starting February 15th, and it's just, That's early. Yeah, to get 50 plus games in, and during the academic year, to end in time by May, it's just, It's crazy. It's interesting, because we use that as a sell that we play a lot of games, I think that's what all the kids want to hear, that you're playing a schedule comparable to a National Juco, or NCAA Division I or II team that plays 50 plus games, calendar wise, unless you're playing five games a week, which none of the college teams are doing because of school. it's a college football type schedule. You get banged up on the weekends and then recover during the week to get 50, 54 of those in, it's just, It's a lot. Who do you do a double header on a Friday and a single game on Saturday or the other way around? We go double, Friday, Sunday. Yeah, it depends if there's rain, sometimes we'll go Friday, Saturday, sometimes we'll go Saturday, Sunday. Sometimes we go Friday, Sunday, just depending on field availability and weather. Will you play any games during the week then? Yeah, a few. Some of the new coaches at new schools want to look at that. with new teams in the league and, field availability issues, it's Harder than it was. I wouldn't be against it, but logistically it might be tough. part of the problem in the NWAC is a lot of the schools, in our region, don't control their own facility. They rent it, from the city or have to share it. in our region in particular, there's only two schools that literally could just hop onto their field and play any time as far as not having to go through hoops. reserve a time block or share with the soccer team it's hard to just flip the schedule format all around. Cause there's other people to think about. And, so that makes everything rough when you don't control your own facilities. Other regions are different. So some whole, the whole region, everyone has their own field right on campus. So it's just depends on logistics. When you share, you get bigger bang for your buck, but then you get the obstacles you want it, I want to go back to recruiting a little bit, coach, I, love the fact that you're looking for those tweeners, you're looking for guys that throw strikes, you're looking for guys that can get on base and, produce right away. Tell me about culture building. what are the two or three things you're looking for when you're watching a high school baseball game? What are some of the things you're looking for in terms of the type of young man that you want? it's getting harder to find the guy that's really going to adapt to the buying of the team as easily, mainly because especially in baseball, it's such an individually based recruiting platform. you don't see a whole lot of teams doing stuff year round. To help with that process. A lot of times it's the player on, his own, signing up for events right now I just talked to a summer travel team coach who lost three of his players cause they had to go to an individual tryout for a recruitment purpose, so They sign up for the travel team to help get recruited, but then they leave the travel team to go to an individual. that's becoming the common method now. gone are the days where the kid just played on his high school team, then played on his legion team on his high school teammates, there was some continuity as far as just line of communication and whatnot. so that part's changed. So yeah, you have to work a little bit harder on that. cause now the, this generation of. Players coming in. Their only concept of team is their high school team. And, sadly, some of'em say the high school season doesn't mean anything, which is a strike against them. they're basically saying that the team concept and working towards a goal isn't all that important. I get what their intentions are saying that the level of play. And the length of the season is what doesn't make it as meaningful as their travel teams in the summer. But there is value in working towards a state championship for a high school team, especially when you've been part of the program for three or four years. it's, really changed because five years ago, players weren't bolting out of their travel team tournaments. to go to all these individual things, but because they're popping up now and because a lot of college coaches are utilizing those platforms to look at players, it's just the way it's working now. So if you've got this as a platform, what would you, parents that are trying to get their son recruited, so they understand don't have to spend two, 3, 000 in addition on showcases every year, what advice would you give them in terms of. The best way to get seen and evaluated by somebody like you to utilize all platforms, as far as references, meaning like their summer coach or their high school coach, if they're able to help. So we put quite a bit of stock in the high school coaches, as far as referring players Some of them will go out of their way to really help their players. Some won't do a thing. Some have publicly told their players at their high school parent meeting, at the beginning of the year, the high school coach has no role or duty to do that. others say they want to take an active part in it. it is quite mixed. I respect both angles because if I'm a part time high school coach. It's hard enough assembling a varsity, a JV and a C team, in 10 days with a low salary. I respect that view but regardless of their role in helping the players with the recruitment, we'll still reach out to those high school coaches. So we don't expect them to be proactive. but we will still call them to get their angle on how good of a teammate the player is how do you feel about a 17 year old reaching out to you through an email or a phone call? We got a couple from some 16 year olds this year. So we told him slow down. We're not on class of 2026 yet. But we'll be there shortly. Do you put them in a database? Do you at least get back to them in a year? What do you want to see out of that communication? Mainly if they're switching summer teams, to keep us posted. The kids jump around a lot from travel. I think they do in all sports where they're bouncing from club to club. I think just exploring what might be a better pathway. Usually it's the same pathway as their old club. But, yeah, just being able to follow a player. If let's say my son wanted to play for you and he was going to send you some film, what do you, want to see in that film? the full play meeting, not just zoomed in on the player. So for example, a catcher, on a throw down, actually seeing where the throw goes, we get a surprising number of, parents just because of where they're sitting in the view angle through the fence. just get the throw off, just their body, but we don't necessarily see where it's going. They're running, going all the way to first. the swing and the throw for the pitchers from the side at a 90 degree angle. from the open side, that's tough for some people because you can't get access, to the side of the field. But you want to do good viewing angles. A lot of the film we get is from up in the bleachers at a diagonal. Yeah, England's kind of hard you can see basics, but it doesn't really do good for evaluation of, pitching mechanics or swing mechanics. If it's taken from the 10th row halfway up the first baseline. but I understand depending on the facility, it's limited. I've got a lot of college baseball coaches tell me that they prefer practice footage over game footage, where they can see a young man swing the bat 20 times in a row, take 20 ground balls at third, throw 20 pitches from behind the pitcher. And then 20 pitches from behind the catcher. Do you prefer that or do you like the game footage? I like the game as well. I've seen plenty of practice players that throw great in bullpens. But then don't repeat it in the games. I can see it both ways. the game clips are a little, edited too much where it's almost too much of their great skills. Where I think in a practice thing, you can get more of the real person, more of the technique. There's also their flaws as well. So there's nothing wrong with a film clip of, a round of 10 swings on the field, and three of'em are popups. that's probably better than just the highlight of the last three months of the 10 best hits but you don't see that. The 50 strikeouts on the flip. you're a professional teacher. You're a professional trainer. you want, to see missing? where's that, line angle? where's that pitch? do they, miss low? Do they miss high? Are they not tilting their hips? So that's great. I love what you said about the catchers and that game angle, because as a catcher, I'd want to see. I'd want to see the lead off. I'd want to see what that guy on first is doing. What kind of jump they're getting before I make that pop and throw. Is that helpful for you too? Yeah. And the game footage, as far as receiving, just seeing how they're receiving pitches when, again, that's hard to do. Cause you need almost a zoom lens from center field. You do. Yeah. No, it's not realistic, but the film that's worthless is almost like when they show blocking and the coach is throwing 10 mile an hour lob balls in front of their chest and blocking. it's almost a waste of film footage. So especially for catchers, everything needs to be at game speed, I want to go back to culture building obviously you got to have talent's got to be there for winning and putting runs on the board and keeping runs off the board for the other team. What kind of young man are you looking for? what are those things that when you watch a kid play, it gets you excited about getting to know that kid. Once you see that there's some talent there and maybe on the other side of it, what are some of those things that really turned you off when you see him on the field? So we look at a lot of their dugout antics. it's quite interesting to watch what the players are doing or not doing, when they show up, to the field early. Matter of fact, it just happened last night. There were two 18 year old travel ball teams on our field and the coaches weren't there yet. So we're just watching the mannerisms and the words coming out of their mouths. to get a read on their character and their attitudes. we watch them, I like to watch a guy near the end of the game in the eighth inning when they're down 10 1 to see if they're sneaking onto their phone Or already got their crocs on, Still engaged or not little things like that. if you saw a kid go four for five with a home run and, or he threw, seven shot out innings, and then you see him at the end of the game, giving up on his team, totally into himself it would be a red flag. Yeah, like I said, a lot of times it just happens because they allow it to happen or they don't care. I'm not actively involved in summer league teams every day. so it's not my business to say that it's settled or not. it's my job to evaluate if that's going to fit into a college program. But, yeah, we look at that mainly because, like I said, the, culture and the trend, and I think it's just driven by just the times of today. It's just the families and the players feel like it's, they have to be more Independent as far as the recruiting process and just be on your own. it's been real interesting to see how that's changed literally in the last 10 years. I think it's, a really important perspective for all the families and the kids that listen to this podcast, They need to understand that you're not just showing up at the time. The first pitch is being thrown. You're there 20, 30 minutes early. You're looking at warmups. You're watching what's going on in the dugout. And if you don't like what you hear, you're telling yourself, I don't know if I want to coach that kid. I don't know that my kid might come in and be more problems than he's worth, but I think there's a lot of value. Do you do the same thing with your ears when parents are around you, when you're in the stands? Yeah, I'm usually not around them though. I usually go off to the side or, if I'm behind home plate, I'm not there for long, so that's just me. a lot of other college coaches purposely, get into the dialogue with the parents for that reason, because they want to see what kind of, how the parents are. as far as just the personnel and whatnot. So yeah, I usually just save that for the recruiting visit or ask the high school coach. you can learn a lot in that question. Yeah. I, used to go to games all the time and I wouldn't wear my school colors. I wouldn't wear our logo, and I would just, I'd sit up in the stands and just listen For 30, 40 minutes before I go down to the field or go down to closer. So here's some interesting things while you're up there. Yeah, it's funny you mentioned that. I was just at a recruiting event last week and another college poet made some smart aleck comment about me because I was the only college coach there without wearing my gear. I came in a white golf shirt and a visor. So the parents didn't know if I was recruiting for the live golf tour or for the NWAC, You have to be smart. you have to be incognito because otherwise everybody acts the way. They think you want them to act instead of being natural in their environment. You want to see kids in their environment. You want to see parents in their environment, Actually got that probably 20 years ago. Pat Murphy was the coach at Arizona state. Yeah. He has his, assistance going neutral gear. Yeah, you had a recruiting events and they had to sit far up in the corner It used to be called team one down in Tempe and the Arizona state coaches would be up in the corner, not socializing with the other coaches wearing neutral, attire. I've seen it done before. It's not common, but that's actually why I do it. Pat's really proven that he's the real deal, no matter what level he's at, when I was, a young coach, just starting out he was at Notre Dame. this was in the kingdom in Seattle, they used to have a tournament out there and, yeah, they play the Huskies in the kingdom. So we're way back in time now, but it's, always exciting for me to see coaches move up, to see a guy like Pat Murphy was a really good college coach and that now to see. Those same principles, work at the major league baseball level. I think a lot of people see divisions and they think that's the quality goes with the division. And that's not the case, that's why I was excited to talk to you. You're one of the, you're one of the best coaches in, your level, and a lot of times people don't even know who you are outside of Oregon and Washington. So I think that's really cool to see a guy like Pat, get those opportunities. prove is worth at the highest level. I coach, I want to talk a little bit, about. how you see the game. at the major league baseball level, we're seeing a guy like Kyle Schwarber, who didn't even bat 200 last year, be a lead off hitter. he's got a 360 OBP, but when you're comprising your roster and building that roster. what's a perfect lineup for you in terms of your batters, your fielders, your who's going to hit first, second, third, fourth, what you're pitching rotations looking like. Are you thinking about that when you're recruiting? yeah, looking at who's coming back. So obviously the sophomores that are proven in certain spots, you're trying to recruit around that, when you project your lineup and whatnot. Ever since, pandemic, when we had the high roster with all those returning guys and a veteran club, we've lost our 50, 50 mix, meaning half of our team back and half of our team departing for the last five, six years, it's been skewed where we go one year, a lot of freshmen like this past year for us, and then the next year, a lot of older sophomores. So then that impacts the recruiting, the envisioning freshman you think might fit in to play immediately. It's going on right now for this upcoming year because we have so many returning pitchers. That's a good problem to have. Where do any of the freshmen now fit in? I think a few will. So we'll come down to strike ability and coach ability. And yeah, so it'll be the ones that buy in quickly and adapt quickest. Because we'll need a few of them. I'll date myself a little bit. I miss the Whitey Herzog. It still bothers me when I don't see speed at the top of a lineup. It still bothers me when I see a two hitter that can't hit behind a runner. am I a fossil when it comes to that thing? I think Ohtani is batting lead off now for the Dodgers. he would have been a three hitter or a four hitter 20 years ago, all the time. some teams have done that. in the past, we're just the best guy. Average wise, they just got to put at the top. some people look at it as not necessarily top of the line for speed, but who's going to get up the most number of times. I know it's real common in, some college conferences that play seven inning games. Because in the seven inning game, the bottom of the lineup, if the opposing pitch is good, he's only going to hit two times. That's right. So it's not an issue of speed at the top. It's just your best guys average wise. One, two, three, four, because if the other pitchers mowing guys down, seven in a game, it's our region doesn't do sevens, but the other region in the NWAC, a couple of them do. Yeah. It's a big, difference between two innings. Obviously they know that they're seven, eight, nine, they're facing good pitchers only when they hit twice. that impacts the lineup as well. We've done that in the past. David, the other coach, does the lineup and he's done that on occasion when he'll put, not necessarily the fast guy, but the guy who's just getting on base, even with a 210 average, but walks a lot or gets hit by pitches. there's that Kyle Schwarber, right? Yeah. And then our level, unfortunately there's a lot of hit batters. a lot of pitchers trying to throw hard and a lot of arm side misses, they can't build enough armored gear to protect everybody part, from elbow sleeves, the chin strap, guards, the Ankle braces. Robo getting to the point where there's going to be an entire front side of the body covered with hard metal or plastic. you mentioned before, pitchers are throwing harder. we've had, five players hit in the head with 90 plus mountain. Yeah, that's scary. So it's, I don't blame them for wearing the, armor, but again, that has changed too, just with the pitchers throwing harder. Now the bar has been raised and it's, I was telling a player today. That his old, his travel coach, he played in the major leagues. His best bullet was 88 miles an hour in high school. And he was one of the top pitchers at Washington state and he never threw harder than 87 miles an hour. And it was 15 and oh, and NCA division one for a good club. yeah. Now you see guys on ESPN on the world series thrown 95, 96. And yeah, I don't remember. I don't remember ever seeing a kid probably, I saw somebody throw and hit against when I was 17, maybe hitting 90, 91 at 18. But I don't, ever remember. Consistently seeing 88, 89 out of high school kids, like you see now, it's crazy. Yeah. the radar gun technology, changed back in the eighties, the Nolan Ryan days, they didn't have Doppler radar technology. Original RA gun and the jugs gun. Back then they only had the technology to measure speed either out of the hand or over the plate. And the old days it was the speed over the plate. And obviously as the ball travels out of the hands, it gets slower. So back in the day, the guy throwing 85, 86, that was the speed over the plate that was considered. Gas, right? So probably out of the hand three or four mile an hour fast. Yeah. Yeah. So it's, changed. yeah. It's been interesting. coach, I know you got a lot going on with camp and getting ready for, kids coming back to campus. I've got one question I ask all coaches, if I, put you on a stage right now and there's 300 parents in the audience and they're there simply to understand recruiting better, give parents one piece of advice that you'd like all parents to absorb as they go into their recruiting journey with their kid. mainly just to polish all the skills and just let whatever happens. I say that because at least in baseball, I don't know about the other sports. But there's this big chase in high school and it seems like there's an increasing number of players that go to a big school or a four year school out of high school and they don't end up staying there. And so if they actually knew that now when their kid's 16, 17, I think you would put a different perspective on their methods or sense of urgency to do things a certain we have players that end their careers after four years or after one year with us or two years and, it ends for everyone. it's, interesting. We had a player who opted not to play baseball after one year. He was just going to go to school he spent all his life chasing the dream of getting recruited. And then as soon as you get to college, it's just too much time and too much work and not worth it. So it's just a shame. and I hear stories like that from other college coaches as well. Every year you have a kid that you thought, Okay, this kid's gonna be a difference maker. And they walk in your office the second week of school and say, I don't think I'm gonna play anymore. It's like, they needed to, detach from their parents before they realized what they really wanted, so that's a shame. coach, thank you so much for taking time out on a Friday afternoon for me. And, it's so great to meet you and, to see the great things you're doing at your school. I wish you guys all the best of luck in your upcoming season. We're just trying to do our best to uphold the NWAC brand and real great tradition we've got going in the NWAC overall with baseball, with the number of players that have reached the big leagues or big four year schools. NWAC baseball has always been a great option regardless of the school, so it's been a great conference to be a part of in my tenure. I thank you for your time and your dedication to all these kids and what you do as a coach and a teacher. we'll look forward to cheering for you in the future. Thanks again. Thank you. Thank you, Matt. Bye bye. So that's a wrap for this episode of the significant coaching podcast. I'd like to thank my great guests, mark Yoshino from Bellevue college up in Washington. Most people don't know that I was a baseball coach before I started coaching basketball. So whenever I get to talk baseball with a great long time coach, like coach Yoshino, it's a fun day for me. So this was a very enjoyable conversation. I hope it was for you as well. Thanks again for listening. Have a significant week. I'm Matt Rogers. Goodbye. Till next time.