Episode #65: Emily Kiablick

Cool Under Pressure: Emily Kiablick on Culture, Calm, and Coaching with Clarity

In this episode of Significant Coaching with Matt Rogers, we sit down with Emily Kiablick ("Coach Kabs"), the all-time winningest coach in Wheaton College women’s lacrosse history. Known for her calm leadership and deep care for team chemistry, Emily opens up about what it takes to build not just a successful team—but a connected one.

With 17 seasons at the helm and a career filled with championships, accolades, and postseason appearances, Emily shares the why behind her winning culture. Whether you’re a coach, a parent, or a leader in any field, this conversation is a masterclass in staying grounded, focused, and purpose-driven.

🎯 In this episode, you'll hear about:

• 🧊 How Emily stays cool under pressure and why that matters for her team
• 📚 The leadership book clubs and DISC assessments she uses to build team connection
• 🏆 Lessons from a career filled with success on and off the field
• 👥 Why she believes being a great teammate is more important than being a great player
• 🧠 The power of self-awareness in college athletics
• 🥍 Behind-the-scenes stories from building programs at Roger Williams and Wheaton

If you're a coach or a parent of an aspiring college athlete, don’t forget to visit coachmattrogers.com for:

• 📘 Significant Recruiting: The Playbook for Prospective College Athletes
• ✍️ Weekly blog posts on recruiting, leadership, and life skills
• 📅 Personalized recruiting strategy sessions
• 🎤 Booking info for speaking engagements on recruiting, leadership, and the journey to college

Thanks for listening—and remember: Significance always wins.

Transcript

0:01

Welcome back to the Significant Coaching Podcast, the podcast where we dive into the minds and methods of coaches who lead with purpose, develop people, and build programs that matter. I'm your host, coach Matt Rogers, and today's guest brings a level of consistency, composure, and care that every coach and competitor can learn from. Emily Ka. Is entering her 17th season as the head women's lacrosse coach at NCAA Division three, Wheaton College in Massachusetts, where she's become the winningest coach in program history. Her teams have made the Nuac tournament every year. It's existed during her tenure. Notching eight semi-final appearances in the past 11 seasons. Her 2014 squad posted one of the best seasons. In school history, winning both the regular season and tournament titles and advancing to the second round of the NCAA tournament. But if you ask anyone who knows Coach Cabs, they'll tell you her success goes far beyond the scoreboard. She's got that rare coaching superpower. She never gets too high, never too low. Her even keeled leadership brings stability and high pressure moments and sets a powerful example for her players and for fellow coaches alike. What makes Emily's approach so significant is how deeply she cares about who her players are to each other. Her teams aren't just taught systems. They're taught how to be teammates. She brings in tools like the DISC assessment. To help her athletes better understand each other's values and communication styles. She runs leadership book clubs with her captains and staff, and she creates an environment where every voice matters because she knows championship culture starts with connection. From building programs at Roger Williams to being featured in a PBS series on amazing women in coaching to helping her players become both better athletes and better people. Emily Kalik is the kind of coach who leaves a legacy long after the final whistle blows. All right, before we jump into this great conversation, don't forget to visit coach matt rogers.com for all your recruiting and college prep resources, including my book, significant Recruiting, the Playbook for Prospective College Athletes. after the final whistle blows. I. All right, before we jump into this great conversation, don't forget to visit coach matt rogers.com for all your recruiting and college prep resources, including my book, significant Recruiting, the Playbook for Prospective College Athletes. I. And if this podcast brings you value, hit that like button, leave a rating and share it with a friend. It helps more than Athletes. And if this podcast brings you value, hit that like button, leave a rating and share it with a friend. It helps more than you know. alright, let's get into it. Here's my conversation with Coach Cabs, Emily Kalik. Coach, I gotta ask you about this.'cause this was really cool. Rhode Island's amazing women in coaching. Oh, that. Oh my gosh, I forgot about that. That was, TV show on their public broadcast network. And yeah, I was very young and I was on with a couple other really truly amazing female coaches. One from Brown, one from Brian, I believe. And yeah, it was a really cool opportunity that I stumbled upon being in. The smallest state and was a young head coach, but I got to be on it and that's so cool. What a great compliment. Yeah, it was really cool. I didn't know what I was getting myself into'cause I was young, I was flying by the seat of my pants and I got, be on the show Are, were you born in Rhode Island? Born and raised? No, I'm from Western Massachusetts and then I went to Springfield out there, okay. Rhode Island was a big move even though I stayed right in New England. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. You've done so many good things. I always, because I got to coach at two different schools, people just think you move from one school to the other. It's basically the same thing. It's so different depending on who your president is and who your athletic director is and what your budget is and what type of school it is. You've led two programs to really great success athletically and academically. You rebuilt two programs. where do you begin when you start a program? When you take a program over and you talked about being real young when you, your first job. What and what changed from job one to job two and how you began? Definitely a lot changed from the way I approached things. When I started at Roger Williams, I was coaching soccer and lacrosse There. And then when I moved over six and a half years later, moved over to Wheaton, I took a lot of what I had done early on and did it completely opposite because I was so young and I was just really, brash and really, flip things on its head and it worked. But I, it was the path with the most resistance rather than really taking inventory that, I'm just a part of the program and things have, there's rituals and there's. Things that these players are accustomed to and I have to really respect their past. And I don't think I had the maturity to do that when I started at Roger Williams, but at Wheaton I did do that. I knew it was a program that had a lot of success even though they hadn't recently. And I really. I felt like I did a much better job of honoring the student, honoring their experience. When I started at Roger Williams, though, I really, I was trying to make a name for myself, and I think, of course, looking back on it I probably was too concerned with myself in my role in it, rather than taking. The bigger picture into consideration. I can tell you the exact same story. You're so worried about winning and for me, it was almost, I don't wanna lose this job. I don't want anybody to look at me and say, we made a mistake. And the second job was. I want these kids to have a great experience. I want'em to leave here knowing how to play, knowing how good they are, knowing their self-worth, it was just a complete turnaround in what I wanted. And it sounds like you had that same philosophy. Oh, for sure. And those 2009 grads, they were seniors and I had started in January of their senior year. I'm still in touch with them. That's great. I really valued. How open they were to me coming in. That's just not easy to be traveling along and then all of a sudden heading into spring, your senior season, you've got a new coach. And they really were very accepting of me, and I'm so grateful. They were great athletes, great people, and they're still in my life, so I'm glad I took that approach because it gave me some great relationships that I saw. I agree. There's nothing better. It's the best thing about what we do. Talk a little bit about developing that whole person, because when you're at a school like Wheaton, you can't just recruit a bunch of athletes. They have to have high character. they have to be really good students. What are you doing as a coach to develop that whole person and make sure they're leaving your program as good adults and ready for the world. One thing we do is we make sure that they understand that's our objective in the recruiting process and that developing as people, but then also our program like. Gaining in trust and gaining, and just the ability to navigate those difficult conversations is our mission every single season. Like we're working really tirelessly to cultivate that atmosphere. So that's the first thing we do is make sure it's really clear. In our recruiting process because I think most people recruiting are like, that sounds great. I really want that holistic approach. But certainly if a kid wanted to just But then with that, we do as much off the field together as we do on the field. Every single day we're meeting, we have a space, it's just called the classroom. And every day before and sometimes after practice, we're meeting and just talking about our values, talking about our goals. Rehashing the last game, making sure that we don't move on to the next without knowing that we're like all on the same page. It's the mental coaching is so important. Yeah. Definitely. All layers of it. And then beyond that, I would say with leadership development, there's a lot we do. Our captains and coaches spent the fall in a book club reading Five Dysfunctions of a Team, just, they're students and it's, there's a lot they have going on, but that's a really easy book to digest. And so we met with them weekly and had our book chat and talked about our goals for the season. And then with the team, they've all done the disc assessment this year, so we've all. Reflected on our personality and leadership styles and what works well with others, what doesn't work as well, where we sometimes meet conflict. And I think right now we're just at that place where we really, while sometimes we do hit conflict with each other, we need each other and everyone's leadership style is so valuable. And we wouldn't be. Nearly as successful if we didn't have all these different folks making up our team. I love that you talk about your team. Is everyone carrying that moniker as a leader? I think that gets lost sometimes that everybody's got a responsibility to lead. They look different from the girl next to you, the woman next to you, or the coach next to you. But everybody's got that responsibility. Do you preach that on the front end or do you find a way. To just get that out of them in different ways. I don't think I'm as obvious. I feel like I do find ways to get it out of them in different ways. I think a lot is like undoing preconceived ideas of what leadership is. And so I feel like that we spend more time with that and instilling, I don't know, just validating someone's leadership style just because they're not the most vocal or they don't have that really dominant personality. And so we really work to give space to all those people. So we're hearing everyone's voice and sometimes the most introverted kid is saying the most meaningful things and we all just need to quiet down so they can have space to say it. That's why the disc assessment can be so powerful is it's really obvious when you go through that there's more than one type of leader there. Everybody is getting assessed to go, this is your leadership style. Yeah. You don't have to be something else. You don't have to try and be real loud or real vocal or real demanding or real physical. You can be a leader, just who you are, so I love that you're doing that. You talked about the five Dysfunctions as a team. And the DISC assessment, what were some of your players' takeaways from the book and from the DISC assessment? With the DISC assessment, I think a huge takeaway is they really start to understand me and anticipate me, and I think that's really empowering for them. And like each other and each other's teammates. But one thing, I'm on the DISC assessment. Anyone who's familiar with it, like I'm lowest in I'm like very much a tactical minded coach. I never ever show emotion ever. Like maybe you'll get yelled at me by me a couple times in your time, but I certainly never get excited. However, a lot of my athletes are really high eyes, and I think I very intentionally look for that when I'm recruiting. And just a kid who's like really fiery and gets excited because to me I'm just oh, they're not gonna need that for me. That's great. Like they'll, and so we really, our bench is rowdy and loud and our team is the same way and they're really, they get each other fired up. But I think. Anytime we do the disc assessment, that like further assures them that they have the space to do that. I love that. That is really empowering. It's really powerful stuff. Oops. Do you find, and it's the first time a coach has ever told me, and I don't think I've ever thought like that. I always think about, I've gotta find an assistant that's opposite of me and has all the strengths of all my weaknesses, which is terribly hard to find.'cause I have so many weaknesses. But I've never heard a coach talk about really recruiting players that. I have some of those strengths that maybe are a little uncomfortable for you or something you don't like to, that world you don't like to get into. So that is pretty you think about that. You're pretty proactive with that thought. Yeah I definitely, I think the first time I did the disc assessment, I started to think about that. And sometimes those athletes are the ones that drove me nuts a little bit. Like they're just, I just wanted them to be more steady and not get on the rollercoaster and that kind of thing. But it helped me to realize I'm not really bringing a lot of that like rah energy, so like they need it. And so it helped me to appreciate that a lot more. And yeah, now I've done my own disc assessment. I've evolved over 15 years now. So now I very much am intentional in looking for it. But yeah, early on I think I kinda was like, oh, that kid's too rowdy or too high and low just might pass on them. And now I have a real place in my heart for those kids. So this, this is a phrase that people throw around a lot, the love language. Your love language isn't screaming and yelling and you're not the hype master. What is your love language? How do they know that they, that you love'em and you got their back? Where do they get that from you? The, just in feedback and. The way I just will continuously challenge them. I challenge them as a group. I challenge them individually, but if I really think a kid is like fully bought in and they really are like up for the challenge, I get so excited. Sometimes I have to like tamp that down'cause I'm just giving them. An ever ending stream of okay, we'll try this or tweak this, or whatever. And sometimes I, from my own DISC assessment know that I don't need to be problem solving all the time. They might just wanna sit in a space where they're just becoming a master of something. But that's probably the biggest thing. One-on-one meetings are huge, like when they come in and can talk about that because I'm very direct. And that also is good because it gives me time to say what I really value that they're doing. Yeah. And I don't always take that opportunity and open forum. I'm usually just like addressing the group as a whole. But when they come into the office, I can. Really spell out what they're bringing to the table and why I value it so much. the more we talk coach, the more I can just imagine there's three girls outside your office right now just waiting for the door to open so they can come in and talk to you because, not yet. I feel because you are the way you are and you own who you are so well and with so much confidence, I would imagine you've got girls that just. They come looking for more, they want more conversation with you. They want more advice. They want you to build them up a little bit more. Do you find that? Definitely. And I think the pandemic was hard because they couldn't just come in here. And I feel like we're very intentionally my staff trying to create more of that space. And I think that's been a huge part of our success this year is that. It's feeling back to normal for us. And it took that long, but it was like a whole year where kids couldn't get those one-on-one meetings unless it was out by the field and we were like six feet apart, right? And it seems crazy, but it's really taken that long to undo what that year did. So this year I feel like it's back to pre pandemic open door policy, and that is having a really positive impact on our play. That's so great. Yeah I was coaching a little bit of high school ball during the pandemic, and it was just so hard. because you couldn't be with the kids. All the time. And there wasn't the touchy feely and there wasn't the the non-game stuff and the non-practice stuff that normally you would do. it just felt so hollow. It just felt gosh, this isn't why I got into this. To coach games and just coach Prague, you got into it for relationships and, to see them grow. So it was, it's so cool that it's starting to come back and you're starting to feel that it was so many lost years because of that. Yeah. And it helped. Last year I hired an alum and she graduated in 2020 and that was one of the first observations she made was just like, where is everybody? And I was like, yeah. They just don't come in as much as they you guys used to. Yeah, because of the pandemic. And we just had that separation then everyone got a routine of it. And, but she did help me realize, and so she was a big part of the. Implementing our book club and like doing some very intentional things to create more space to talk off the field. And it, yeah, I mean we had a tough one this past weekend and we're gonna have a classroom session today and I know it's gonna be incredibly productive and reset us for Wednesday. It's so good. Nobody likes to get their butt whipped in a game in the middle of a season, but sometimes it's the catalyst to what's to come, just a reminder of, Hey we're pretty good. Yeah. This was a bad day, yeah. It's we gotta walk away from that bad day. And remember all the days before that, we're still that same team. I wish we didn't have to suffer, but we are certainly that team that when we have those setbacks, we gain so much from it. So one of my big words is significance. I had a speaker many years ago say, I want you to remove the word success from your vocabulary and replace it with significance. And the idea is not worrying about the scoreboard, but the process of doing things the right way and doing it together to get that number on the scoreboard you want when you look at a season. How do you define that success or that significance? How do you know that, Hey, we had a good year, no matter what the record looks like. I think first it's in the type of teammates we are to each other. I think if we care about each other and we. Really show that. And I can feel that, to me, that's like the epitome of success is just like caring about each other, caring about the program. And I've really been very fortunate, Wheaton's a wonderful place to recruit to.'cause it's like cultivated in our student body and then we just go that much deeper as a lacrosse program. But that's it. I happen to be in the midst of a season where it's so evident that the athletes care so deeply for each other. So I would say that I really do, I like what you said about significance because I think I've coached for so long now and every single year, regardless of the indices and record everyone's given. The same output doesn't, if we won a conference championship that year or like we barely held on and made the conference tournament but got knocked out the first round, it really, I don't see the championship team as like having really inputted more. I think that everyone, it's just circumstantial. It's do we, are we healthy? Do the stars kind of align for us? Do we get things done that season? And sometimes like injuries happen, things happen, but everyone's working just as hard. So I never want athletes to feel like they weren't as valued or they didn't do as much because we didn't get the end result. Because every year of co-chair, Everyone works so, so hard and it's really hard to be a college athlete. Like harder than when I was in college. There's just so many demands on them and they are so disciplined and work so hard at it, so they Deserve to feel that like that they've inputted and gotten stuff out of it. It's a great testament to the women. That you're attracted to, to recruit, that catches your eye.'cause not every coach can say that, no matter what school, not every coach can say, wow, we just have kids that really buy in and, they're accountable and they're doing their work. So it says a lot about you and how you're building it and the purpose behind it. So I love that. Yeah. I want to go back to the five dysfunctions as a team. I love that you read it. I haven't read that book, but I'm going to, I've had a couple coaches tell me about it. I don't know how obvious those five dysfunctions are, but I'm curious with the culture that you have. Did your team read it and go, these are obvious. Yeah. We're not gonna let any of these things will never be a part of our Wheaton program or were there like, wow, that makes a lot of sense. That is something we need to be more aware of. Was there that moment where kind of the eyes opened up or was there that moment that Yeah, we don't have any problems with this. So it was just our captains that read it with us, and I think it, their eyes did open up. I think they, so the five dysfunctions at the base or the core of it is the top is results. And it's like basically you can't, I. Focus or think about your results if you don't get everything underneath set. And so at the base of it is trust and it's trust in that it, not to be confused with like reliability, but trust in that like people feel they can be vulnerable Yeah. In that space. And so that's like the big thing. And so we start to look at. So right away we know okay, we don't have this perfect environment of trust. Like these first years just stepped on campus. There's no way they know, like maybe I haven't even officially announced the roster yet. So they're not that open or trusting to anything yet. They're just like trying to survive. So once we have done that, yeah, we started to I think they just look at okay, every little team bonding thing we've ever done was for this bigger purpose that we're trying to create more of a safe space for each other and be able to build trust. And so now they're in cahoots with us. There was a time we were talking about it was just a little conversation, but. We were pointing out like we've had some slow starts to games and then we've had success, and then a kid chimed in and she's when we have had a really quick start, we really dip in the second quarter, and then another athlete chimes in and it's just thank goodness. Like we had that. and so we started to see that like we're having. Conflict in our conversation. And so in that book it says like you can't have conflict or difficult conversations until you have trust. And so it's this point in the year, but the captains and the coaches all are making eye contact'cause we're all like, this conflict is great.'cause it means like we have trust and yeah. Sometimes teams will pride themselves on like no drama or something like that. I was like. No drama like that just means like there's no trust. Like you're not even scratching the surface, like you're not going anywhere. So to us we are all in cahoots now, Just looking for those little windows where we're like, okay, we're not seeing eye to eye, but we're equipped to deal with this and like it's good that we're not seeing eye to eye. We'll get through this and we'll be stronger for it. It would be far worse if we weren't seeing eye to eye and we weren't even having that conversation. I love it. I just love it. It just gives, it gives me tingles up my spine to, to hear you talk like that.'cause you know that's why we do it. Yeah. That's the significance of coaching, getting a team to do that. my daughter plays club volleyball, and we were in Reno this weekend and you used the word trust and we started to see that this weekend. they're really good cheerleaders of each other and they're great supporters of each other, but we're starting to see how they deal conflict and they're handling conflict head on, come on, you got this. They're pumping each other up and it's, somebody had a bad set or a bad serve or a bad pass and, they're talking there's a timeout. And before they even get to the coach, there's three conversations before they get to the timeout. About what they want to do better and what they're doing well, and what they want to do next play. And I, that, to me, that is the sign of that trust you're talking about is when they're walking off the field. It's not just a bunch of kids walking off the field. They're still a team. They're still playing that game, it hasnt stop. Yeah, for sure. Do you feel that from your group? Yes, Definitely. And in a deeper connection between the folks who are getting the opportunity on game day and those that are like on the bench, there's. It's just all connected. And that to me is like the sign of okay, we're a team, we're a unit. We know everyone knows their value and everyone like knows why we're doing it and what we're trying to do here. And so that it takes time though and you can't, and if you have it one season, you can't just assume it's gonna carry over next season. Yeah, a lot does. But like you, every year you gotta start over and put in all that effort again.'cause sometimes when you go on autopilot, that's when you, things slip away and it's like the chemistry is lost and you didn't even realize it was happening. It's so important from my perspective, whether I'm coaching men or women, that they learn how to be critical of each other and it's not the end of the world, and I'm not saying you're terrible, you don't say you're terrible. It's, we need more effort out of you. And that person to be able to say, you're right, I gotta bring more to get that to happen. Is the sign of a championship team that team's gonna do really well that year? Do you disagree? I agree. I think that's the love language. When you can say it, it's not coming from you need to do better because I want you to do better. It's you need to do better because you're capable of doing better. And so to me that when you have a team that can hold each other accountable that way because they believe in each other, then yeah. They're in a good spot. Yeah. Gotta be able to tell each other the truth. It's a, I don't know if you're married or not, but it's, that's when a relationship really for me, it peaks when my wife can yell at me and I go, okay, you're right. I gotta do better. I gotta be more on time. I can't be so distracted and I can kick her in the butt about something and she'd go, you're right. I gotta do better. So I love that. I just love that idea. That we're making that a focus and how we wanna treat each other. And it's okay to be critical as long as we're accountable, right? Yes. Yeah, for sure. Yes. And I am married with two kids, so I learned quick, pretty early on. Yeah. When my 11-year-old now is young, I would bring work home or like the, or. She was won. We won a Mack championship, but any loss we had as really over and over again. My wife had to point out that our 1-year-old doesn't care that we lost. I was like, noted. Yeah, exactly. I feel like that was so valuable to Oh, yeah. That was huge for me. When I stopped coaching at the college level, my kids were four and one, it's amazing what children can do to the perspective of what we do, so much easier to let it go after a bad loss when, there's two kids going, mommy, yeah. I just wanna play, I home, I wouldn't play. Yeah, for sure. You've spoken at huge, huge conventions about practices, so I wanna get into practices with you. What do high school youth coaches, what are they doing wrong when they're looking? They got an hour with their kids twice a week. Maybe they're practicing four or five days a week at the high school level. What are they doing wrong that you wish they would reconsider or look at from a different perspective when they're planning their practices? it makes me appreciate coaching college. I love youth coaching youth, but there's definitely challenges. So I won't touch the youth coaches because I'm not sure. I've been stumped many times with coaching youth, but I do think in high school the hardest part is like being a part-time coach or coming right from teaching job to there. But even trying to give some space on the field to like connecting. Athletes and setting intention, setting goals for even the practice so that time is well spent because there's certainly not enough of it. So that's my advice. I think that high school coaches that can create that little bit of space before and after practice, that's pretty valuable. I really think planning. Intentions that go for that practice, but also the entire season. Like what aspects of the game do you wanna develop? Like I've definitely volunteered with coaches before and even at the youth level where I'm like, oh, I'm happy to help you out or something. And they show up and just like nothing's planned or nothing's written down and right. I went to Springfield College, I was on a phys ed track and ended up jumping right into coaching. But it's as a teacher, we would never walk in without a lesson plan. Coaching is like the same, right? You have to have, even if you veer from it, which is totally fine, but you've gotta have it planned out. And you have to know the progression, not just within that practice, but your progression throughout the season so that you can measure it. Are you making progress or are you not? And now you know what to tackle. So that's the biggest thing. I think is just a quick check-in and setting intentions. It's much harder for a kid to float through practice and not be fully accountable or committed. If you've had this 15 minute conversation about. What your practice is about to look like. Yeah. I worked with a high school coach a few years ago, and this coach would walk into practice with a napkin, a back of an envelope, and there'd be two or three things written on, and I was like. This is how we're gonna prepare. This is, yeah, we expect our kids to grow today, Three things on a napkin and get two hours out of our kids. So yeah, I love that. Love those points of emphasis. Think they're terribly valuable. And it's hard. It is hard when you're teaching all day, or you have a full-time job and you have to go coach for two hours afterward? Maybe you have to do it five days a week as a high school coach, but it's so important you find those five minutes to go. Here are the three or four, maybe five things that are really important to our program, our conditioning, our physicality, how we move the ball, our spacing, whatever that may be, our defense. Those are gonna be our focus points. Every single practice, how we get to them is gonna be different, but those are our focus points. So I love that. When it comes to. So I'm gonna transition from practices to games. So when you think about your, you got a new Mac final coming up, a semi-final, a conference match that determines who wins and who loses the conference. Are there things that you put into that practice that are different or do you try and keep them pretty similar, no matter the contest? Yes and no. Like we do keep it pretty similar and we try to really stick to us as much as possible. There's a scouting report and we do talk at length about what. We can expect in an upcoming game, but then always bring it back to us. one way we do that is we create new offenses for each game we play. Usually comes from one we just ran. We're like, we really what we did with this, but based on their defense, we think we can tweak it. the fact that every time we have a new game coming up, there's a new offense that we're putting in and we'll repeat some, but we're really just looking at the opponent and where we're at and what's going well for us. Even though we're changing for every opponent, the fact that we're consistently changing for every opponent makes us at home with that flexibility and so we're staying resilient and flexible because we do that, they're really locked in. Practices like today's Monday, we're gonna put in a slightly different variation of an offense we've done in the past, and they're gonna know okay, here it is. it gives a little bit of energy and excitement for new opponent. We have a STA team, statistical breakdown of every game and seeing how we're progressing in different categories of the game. That kind of guides how we focus our energy, but we do have to be selective because we could spend eight hours doing all the things that we'd like to, work on or talk about, right? So I even at any level, I'm coaching, I try to be like, all right. We can really ask them to focus on three things and get output outta that. If we're going exceeding that, then probably it's all going in one ear at the other. Where are you at ratio wise, with scrimmaging? I was one of those coaches. I just, I was so fundamentally focused and I wanted my guys and gals to be really good at everything. too often my practices were 90 10. Breakdown drills. Three on three, four on four, and then 10% was actual scrimmage. Where are you at with that? At this point of our season, we're rarely scrimmaging. We'll do small sided for just to work on our sevens, but we did utilize it, I don't know, probably 20, 30% scrimmaging in preseason. However, I. It also is, we're in New England, we practice outside starting mid-January. Nothing is better for their fitness than running full field. So That's right. It was our test to be like, okay, we can hold up, we did this and oh, let's show up tomorrow and run another 20 minute and. To me is okay, we can get through a quarter in women's lacrosse is 15 minutes right. And reset and get back out there. So it really was like more of our confidence in our fitness when we do it. Yeah. But I agree, we do try to, sometimes we break things down but we really try to build it back up to game pace with like situational things and unsettled situations and all that. Love that. Yeah it's the great challenge of college coaching because your kids wanna play. They always wanna play, they want compete, and they wanna scrimmage and you want to make sure the pieces. Are together and we understand what we're doing, especially when you're putting new sets in a new offense in all the time, and trying to, confuse your opponent. So they, they're not they don't know what to expect from you, which I love as a coach too. But it's so important that the kids understand. The sooner we understand the parts, the more we can do the big thing, the more we can scrimmage, right? Very true. Yeah. Coach recruiting's my world. And you've, you and I have had a great conversation about recruiting. I'd love to get your philosophy on just how you go about planning a year, two years, three years in your recruiting cycle and what your philosophy is and how you guys recruit. our recruiting cycle is. Earlier than some, but like later than others. We don't particularly love how early lacrosse recruiting is, but it's our reality. So We work within that. But we're really heavily recruiting and seeing sophomores and juniors play. And we're really trying to get them as much information and gather as much information about them. But we also know that a lot changes from that summer going into senior year. I think a lot of kids set out with I want a big school far away, and then I. By the time, July hits, it's like a small school right in their backyard or whatever the case may be. So we try to just give our recruits that space to figure it out. But like along the way, here's all the information about Wheaton. At Wheaton we're able to. Really hone in the summer months going into their senior year in terms of both where they fall at Wheaton, admissions wise, we can get them that information and that's when our class starts to take shape. About now we have some juniors who are committed, but with, they don't have that information. That's really important. So yeah. It's if things change from that, like we're certainly not gonna give them a hard time, but it is reassuring to know Wheaton's their top choice and that's, they have every intention of enrolling here. Yeah. So that's our. Timeline. And then by the beginning of the fall, like our class is locked up and they're getting integrated into our program as much as possible without distracting from their senior seasons. And like really letting them be seniors. But that is, certainly a part of, it's like by the time they come to campus for their orientation or as first years there. They're not even nervous anymore. Like they're just so ingrained and know everybody that it's just a different world. Like they just are ready and so comfortable with it. Yeah. They're coming home. They already know us. Yeah. Love that. Yeah. And we certainly go into every, it's big for us to ID players and to see players who are interested in to evaluate their. Ability to play. But then after that, really the conversations are a big part of it. And like I said, my assistant's an alum of Wheaton, so she's usually the first phone call that they have. And that's incredibly helpful to our process, but also to them like they. Really are getting a very clear perspective of things. Yeah. It's so great. In the first conversation, you can talk to somebody that's not the head coach and go, what was it like to play for coach? Yeah. What can I expect? How does she treat freshmen? You know what's my timeline look like? I love that. That's so good. Yeah. It's so great to have a former player on your staff when you can do it. For sure. That's very cool. Are there. Are there things that are non-negotiables for you when you're watching? Are there, whether that's in athleticism, whether that's a skillset, whether that's an attitude, are there things that you know you like to coach? Yes. I don't want it to sound too black and white, but it, I would say speed. Strength and like skill. But skill could also be like game sense and like that vision too. So those three things, the, if an athlete has all three, then that's wonderful, but it's like one of those with a lot of potential in the other, which is typically. Skill. If they're not as skilled as we'd like, no problem. That's an easy one to build up. Literally within the first month of being here, we have them doing things that bring their skill to just a whole nother level. Lacrosse is just great in that way. So that's it is like you gotta really be bringing. A good amount of speed or a good amount of strength and that can sometimes be in your physique too. It's just like having good size. And then if the skill we tack that on later, then. that's great. Or having a lot of speed, but knowing you haven't even been in the weight room yet, and that's gonna add a whole nother element to it and you can just see that potential in those areas. I tell kids that all the time. Really good coaches, great coaches, all think alike, As soon as they see something that they think they can fix in you, all of a sudden you're a recruit. Because you've got speed, you've got strength, you've got size, you've got something that I can't coach, but there's something that I can make you better at. I can help add to that speed and that strength. For sure. And I love seeing a kid that has all of those things already, but every other coach in the country has also seen them, so We very much know that our success and our best players were developed while they were here. They didn't necessarily come in at that level. but I love that. I love helping be a part of that development. Yeah. I know you gotta run here in a little bit. I'm gonna throw some quick hitters at you just to get your thoughts on a couple things. You and I have been talking about goalies a lot, is what we're looking at in terms of goalies. Is there similar things, speed, strength, iq, vision? Are there certain things you're looking for in a goalie? Very much athleticism. Because there's a few different ways you can go with a goalie. one of our best goalies I've ever coached, her saves were great, but she was an eighth defender. Like she caused so many turnovers and picked up so many ground balls and just, and it was like, usually with a goalie, once they've made a save, you know they're over that and they're locked into the game. This kid was different where I'm like, as soon as she runs around outside the crease, I know she's locked in. So if she comes out to get a 50 50 ball and scoots around out there, then I'm like, I didn't even need to Some of her best games, you'd look at it and you'd be like, oh, she only had five saves. That was weird. She, I'm like, because they couldn't even get the shots off. She was like causing turnovers before it happened. So I think just the vision of what they're gonna be. And so a lot of times like a really athletic kid who's maybe not tracking the ball well yet or isn't technically as sound, you're just like, okay, those things we can obviously work on, but that athleticism and the just going for it, that's an intangible that you'd wanna hold onto. I love it. Gimme one book Every young coach should read. I have a lot. I do think five dysfunctions of a team is just really digestible and it might open your eyes to why things aren't really getting off the ground if you know you're struggling to make a program or cultivate a culture. I also think grit is really reaffirming that we just, just putting in the hours of practice and things like that and that an athlete might not be the most skilled, but if they're motivated, they can really change their trajectory. Absolutely. I love that. If you weren't coaching, what would you be doing? Literally nothing. I have no other balance. I think I would enjoy like consulting with athletes and doing a mental skills type thing and just going down that avenue. Yeah. I've worked with a lot of really great people have helped me to understand the impact I'm having on athletes and how to maybe not add pressure where there's already plenty of pressure there. So I. I've loved those conversations. I think I would probably wanna work one-on-one with athletes just to make sure they're enjoying the experience as much as they possibly can and not weighed down by all the other stuff. If you'll have me, I'm gonna have you do some of that. I'm gonna get you on some webinars. We're gonna get you coaching more kids that way because I think, oh, kids can learn from you. So I'm gonna take advantage of you wherever you'll let me. Most underrated quality and a great assistant coach. I don't know if it's underrated, but an assistant coach that just can give you. Their opinion when it might just be going again, like holding you accountable and just saying like I think the athletes need this right now. And to me that's the most important thing in my assistant is very in tune to that. And sometimes I'm traveling down the wrong path and like she just will be like this is what I think they need right now. And she says that, you have to be gentle with coaches too. So she always sends it, says it in a gentle way, but I'm like, that's exactly what they need. You're right. There's that trust again, coach. Yeah. She trusts you to be able to give that advice and share. I love it. Best piece of advice to give to families going through the recruiting process. That it's really the first big. Decision they're making in their life. And all you can do is empower them to make that decision. And the college coach should also be empowering them to make that decision. And if you're not feeling that, they're empowering them to make that decision and they're trying to make the decision for them, that's probably not the right situation. Like they're not respecting your family and your kid. Enough. And that's the bottom line is if you're a great player and a great person, you're gonna be a great fit at many programs. So don't let anyone convince you that there's only one place where you can do it. It's your decision. Last one. Best piece of advice. This doesn't have anything to do with lacrosse or coaching. It could be parenting, it could be raising kids, it could be just being a human being. Best piece of advice that you've been given that's been significant for you, that you share with others? It does sound very coaching related, but I think it really goes to every aspect. My life is like to not be results driven and to like really be process focused and. Experience everything and be present and enjoy all of that. Because if you're just fixated on the results, whether it's parenting and like your kids, how they're performing in the classroom or in sports, it's just like we just isn't a recipe for success. Like it's just gonna weigh us down. So I think being present and experiencing all aspects of it, even when it's the failures, just living through it and. Yeah, don't skip the process. Be a part of the journey. Enjoy the journey. I love it. Coach. you are fantastic. I'm so glad we met. I'm a huge fan. I'll be sending kids to your right and left from here on out if you'll have'em, if you want to talk to'em because, you're the epitome of significance. You care about your kids, you do it the right way. And just really impressed. So I wish you guys the best of luck here on out. What an awesome conversation with Coach Emily Kalik. Her steady presence, her commitment to team culture and her focus on developing people over just winning games is exactly the kind of leadership we love to spotlight here on significant coaching. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to subscribe, leave a review, and share it with someone who's passionate about coaching and leadership. And don't forget to check out coach matt rogers.com. That's your go-to hub for everything recruiting. In College Prep. You can pick up a copy of my book, significant Recruiting, the Playbook for prospective College Athletes. You can read my weekly blog or schedule a personalized recruiting strategy session for your family with me. If you're a school or organization looking to bring in a speaker on recruiting leadership or the journey to college, I'd love to connect with you there as well. Thanks again for tuning in to significant coaching. Until next time, keep leading with purpose and remember, significance always wins