Episode #168: Val Whiting

 🧠 The Mental Side of Greatness with Val Whiting  | Ep. 168 

On this episode of the Significant Coaching Podcast, Matt Rogers is joined by Val Whiting, former Stanford All-American, WNBA player, two-time NCAA National Champion, and mental performance coach for female athletes.

Val shares her journey from winning championships at Stanford Cardinal women's basketball and playing professionally in the ABL and WNBA to helping athletes strengthen their mindset, confidence, and resilience. She discusses the pressure young female athletes face today, how coaches can create healthier team environments, why identity and self-worth matter, and what true mental toughness really looks like.

This conversation is filled with perspective for coaches, parents, and athletes who want to help young women compete with confidence while staying mentally strong and emotionally healthy.

Topics include:

•  Mental toughness vs. mental health 
•  Confidence and self-worth in female athletes 
•  Handling pressure, comparison, and social media 
•  Creating healthy team culture 
•  The relationship between identity and performance 
•  Advice for coaches, parents, and recruits 

Learn more about Coach Val here:  https://www.instagram.com/iam.coachval/

Subscribe for more conversations with coaches, athletic leaders, and experts helping athletes build stronger futures.

Transcript

0:10

On the latest edition of The Significant Coaching Podcast, a presentation of the coach Matt Rogers YouTube channel. Available audio only everywhere you get your favorite podcast. I'm your host Matt Rogers. Today's guest is former Stanford Cardinal Women's Basketball Great Val Whiting. Val was one of the most dominant players of her era winning two national championships at Stanford, earning multiple All American Honors, playing professionally in the A BL and the WNBA and competing with USA basketball. Today, she has taken those experiences and turned them into a mission to help young athletes become mentally stronger, healthier, and more confident. Through her work as a mental performance coach, she helps athletes handle pressure, build confidence, navigate anxiety, and enjoy the process of competing again. I am incredibly thankful for Val's humility, vulnerability, and honesty. In this conversation, she shares openly about the depression, anxiety, the pressure and perfectionism she experienced as a player, and I think it is essential that young athletes hear stories like hers. Too many athletes think they're alone. When they struggle. They think they're weak or broken, or that something is wrong with them. The reality is that these challenges are. Far more common than people realize. The good news is that there are people who care. There are tools that can help, and there are skills that can be learned, so athletes can get through those difficult moments, enjoy their sport again, and become the best version of themselves. As always, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this episode. Make sure to comment below, subscribe to the channel, and share this conversation with someone who might need to hear it. Alright, here's my conversation with the great Val Whiting. Val, so great to see you. Thanks for being on the show. Thanks for having me, Matt. I appreciate the invitation. Oh, it's my pleasure, Val. You and I went through college about the same time, and so. You know, obviously I was a college basketball player. I, I, maybe they would've let me carry your shoes back then you were a lot, much better player than I was. Um, but you've competed, you've won at the absolute highest level, Stanford, USA basketball. You played in the WNBA. How has your mindset evolved through that journey? Well, I remember when I first started. When I think about my mindset as a coach, um, I coached how I was coached. Yeah. Very old school. Um, no excuses, not leading with love. And then I became a parent. I, and that changed my whole mindset of how I viewed sports and how I viewed, um, athletes. And saw them more as, more than just the basketball player. When I, when I used to do basketball player development. And so, but my mindset when I was an athlete, I don't even remember what my mindset was. It was like, no pain, no gain, um, no days off self-care. What's that? Uh, I definitely have evolved just as I've gotten older and looked at, looked at how, looked back on how I was as an athlete, but also looked at how athletes are today and how they're taking care of their bodies and their mindset and their mental health. So that's how I evolved. It's been just a combination of how I was coached, becoming a parent, and then seeing the effect of how a coach can affect you for years. Down the line changed how I coached because when I think about, when athletes think about their experiences, I'm sure you can think back, Matt, you, you can think of, you can remember the best coaches you've had and the worst coaches you've had and how they probably still are affecting you to this day. So that's why I don't take what I do lightly,'cause I know I'm having an effect on. These young people up, you know, through their adult lives. Well, let's, let's talk about Tara Vandeveer for a little bit. Are, are you open to that? Sure. I, I coached against Tara's sister when I was at the, when I was coached at the University of Laverne. So I got to know them a little bit. And I, I, I played for coaches that were intense that didn't lead with love. You look at, you look at today's game, you look at the D one game and you see some really intense coaches. You see the Danny Hurleys, um, you know, Corey close. A pretty intense coach, but coach, you know those coaches that are leading right now when you think back and those great runs you had at Stanford. Could she have done it differently and still got you guys there? Yes. I think Tara could have done things a lot differently. Um, it, it was a different era that you can. You could say stuff like, now kids will transfer some of the stuff. I think she said to us, they would leave right away. Um, and credit to her. She evolved as the years went on to being more of a people person, being more caring and loving. At least that's what, um, I've, I've noticed from the outside looking in. Are there things that you took away from that experience where you're like, I'm glad I did get pushed. I'm glad I did get challenged. Are there are, is there some of that balance that you think was necessary to get you to where you were? Well, the thing is, I was very self-driven and motivated, so, um. I didn't need to necessarily be pushed. I was pushed by, I wanted to win a champ. We wanted to win a championship. But I also know that what I did like about Tara, um, is that she, um, didn't coach everybody the same. There were some players that she, she yelled at that responded to that. She, there are other players like myself. That needed to be taken aside and spoken to, um, and not put on blast. So I did appreciate that about her. But as a athlete, I, I was motivated by winning. I was motivated by, um, playing well, playing well for my teammates, not letting them down. And also, you, you get motivated by accolades as well. And I, I came from a, a family, like my, my mom and dad are very, um. Um, my dad especially is very, he's, they're very driven people. They, they grew up in, they grew up very poor. They, they both were six years old, picking cotton and picking blueberries to support their family. They grew up in the Jim Crow era, so I, that was how I was raised. Um, you know, work hard. Nothing's given to you. Um. You know, be proud of where you come from. Make, you know, make us proud. And so that, that was always in the back of my mind, just where they came from and, and making my parents proud. They, they came from an era. Even if you did all those things right, you still might not get the recognition, still might get, not get the leg up. How do you think that affected you, that mentality? It is, it, it was a positive and a negative. It, it kind of made you, um, a cynic, you know, for not to talk about race, but for a while as a kid, I didn't trust white people. Sure.'cause of where my parents, how my parents grew up. They would tell my mother their stories. So it was a positive in the fact that, yeah, you know, I know they had these experiences and I learned, you know, from the, their hardships also negative. Like, you can't grow up as a kid not trusting a race just because of their race. So that was, that's something I had to actually work through as I got older, trusting people who didn't look like me and not assuming they were against me because they were white. Hmm. When did that start to change a little bit? When did you, because I think for me, you know, I grew up in a small white town in Illinois. There was no mi, no minorities, no diversity really whatsoever. And I, when I got to college. It was such an awakening for me that I was so thankful for because it was almost like every impression that I had of the world, it was like, really that's, this is, this is not what I expected. And I, and I had to grow up a lot of a lot, but I was so thankful for it. I was so thankful that the world wasn't kind of the way it was presented to me. Did you go through that? Yeah, especially college was the same for me too because I, in high school I went to, um, a pretty much all white Catholic, all girls school. So I didn't have the best experience. Yeah. So, you know, the experience I had was con what my parents, that was confirmed by my experience in high school. And so going to college, you know, not being the only on the team and then having teammates that, um, were white and that I'm still friends with today. That was a change for me as well. Seeing the world differently. Yeah. I, I gotta tell you, I went back and watched a whole bunch of your film from your playing days. Your footwork was so good, you just had great footwork and you used your body so well. Uh, was your mentality a part of that? Because I know, you know, you were a hard worker and determined. At what point did you get that skillset where you're like, okay, I can put the head together and the body together and I can be dominant? When did that happen for you? Um, that actually happened between, um, in the summer of my ninth and 10th grade. Um, so I, I started basketball in seventh grade. Didn't like it, got started by accident, my math teacher, but actually I wanted to be a cheerleader. Wanted to be a cheerleader because I was getting bullied so badly. They was like, if I'm a cheerleader, the bullies are gonna stop. I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be the cool, I'm gonna be a cool kid. But I didn't make it. Um, I didn't even make the mascot. I guess there weren't many six foot tall cheerleaders back in the day. And so my math teacher, Mr. Pearlman, was like, Hey, Val, crying for basketball. And for some reason I said yes, I'd never played a sport in my life. Really? Yeah. Never played any sports. My dad, um. Coached, um, little league football and I would just go watch and run through the tires and stuff. And I think I was a cheerleader for his team, but I never played a sport. And I said, yeah, sure, I'll come out. And, um, made the team. Well, I think everybody made the team. And of course I was the tallest and was really bad. Like I would shoot over the backboard, um, shoot at the wrong basket, get confused when halftime happened, you know, you switch baskets. I was still at the wrong basket. And so my dad would wake me up on Saturday mornings at 6:00 AM and take me out and work on, you know, how to shoot a layup. And he'd have me playing with men, which was ridiculous because like I just started and he had me playing with men. He was always good about putting me in situations to get my butt kicked. It's like he enjoyed it. For some reason. I couldn't, I, I don't know. As a parent, it's hard to watch your kids struggle, but he had no problem doing it. And so by the time ninth grade hit, I was this height, I was 6, 6 3, made JV and then went on varsity a little bit in playoffs, helped the team win the state championship. But between ninth and 10th grade, I went to this summer camp. Back then they had camps where college coaches come, come watch you play and go do drills and Right, right. Scrimmage. They don't, I don't think they have anymore. Really a a u has replaced that. Yeah. And um, I did really well and I was dominant. I have no, it just clicked. And then I got my first letter from a college from actually in the mail. They, back then they mailed you letters. It was from Princeton University. I was like, oh, somebody thinks I'm good and wants me to play for them. And that's how I got really motivated and, and took off. I think the next year I was. Allstate maybe Player of the year. I'm not sure. I can't remember, but I know it was first team Allstate, so yeah, it was between ninth and 10th grade that everything started clicking. It's so hard to get bigs and it doesn't matter if it's boys or girls. To get them to learn to play with their feet first instead of, you know, playing up here. You know, when I watch your film, you do everything foot first. When you were a player who, who taught you that? Where did you get that from? That you're like, this is how, if I can get my space with my feet and then use my body, my lower half, I can be dominant. Where did that come from? Um, it first started with my, my dad. We worked a lot on footwork and. He would have me, um, jump roping and running through tires. They didn't have a generally ladders then, but the tires had me running through tires, getting my knees up. Right. Um, just drilling that, um, not a, I guess old school stuff that still works today. It's not as glamorous. Yeah. Um, and then playing with men, um, getting tough. I was, when I, when I came to Stanford as a freshman, I was, I brought that physicality. They didn't have that east coast. Toughness, that grittiness that they didn't have. And that came from me playing, um, street ball, playing with the, with guys, getting beat up, getting hacked, um, catching bad passes. Like the, my dad always threw bad passes to me so I could. I could catch anything. If they threw it in the paint post, I was gonna catch it. Actually, a parent used to call me the glove on when I was at Stanford'cause there was no pass. I, I couldn't, I couldn't catch. And then at Stanford, we drilled footwork a lot in the post and, um, guard breakdown every day. Constant drilling, footwork, the drop, step drop, dribble hop. What, what do you do? Um, the count counter to the counter moves. And I also had favorite players I watched, I loved watching James Worthy, that was who I looked up to when I was in high school. There was no, there was women's basketball on tv, but it came on TV once a year and that was only, they only put the final four on tv. Right. And still Robert record on my VHS, the final four USC Texas teams like that. Um, and then I would watch it all year round, the same players. So that's where I got most of my, my moves from. I would watch tv, record'em, and then try the moves in the, in the games. We've, we've kinda lost that, haven't we? With, with young players, they, they don't, they don't seem like they watch no skills anymore and go out and try and replace them and, and replicate them. They don't watch whole games. I have clients that are basketball players, volleyball players, uh, and, Hey, did you watch? So and so was on TV for volleyball. No, I didn't watch it. I'm like, what? Yeah. So it's, it is, they're, we're into a short content world now. Yeah. So they're, they're watching highlights, but they're not watching how the game broke down to get to that highlight what happened before that highlight happened. So they don't, they don't get to see, they don't even get to see, um. How athletes bounce back from not doing well. I, I, I gave an athlete of mine, um, an assignment. I want you to watch the final four. Watch the game tonight. And I want you to watch someone who's not doing well and look at her response, how she responded. How does she respond to missing her first three shots? How does she respond to making two turnarounds? Watch that. Uh, what's her body language or what could you do differently? So. I want them to not just watch the game, the highlights. I want them to watch the game and get engrossed in what's going on. The, the ups and the downs, not just the ups. Yeah. The, the, the process of the game is where there's so much growth if kids will sit down and watch it, but it's just so hard to do. You know, it's, it's, it's funny when there's a great game on, whether it's college basketball, boys or girl men or women, right Now, if it's intense, my kids will sit there and watch it with me. If it's, you know, if they're walking the ball up the court and there's any delay, they go find something else to do. Yeah. So, but you know, if you sit there long enough, you're gonna see something really special. If you look. Um, you, you don't have to answer this and we can cut this part out, but why only two years of pro ball for you? I know you went and played overseas a little bit, but why only two years? Because when I wa, when I watch your film, I, your IQ is through the roof. The way you sealed, the way you helped on defense, the way you created for others, the way, the way you created space. There wasn't many players at your size of physicality that could do all of that. Why? Why wasn't your career longer? Well, in total I played 90 40 2002. I think you were asking why was my career longer in WBI played in the A BL. Yeah, the American Basketball League that be existed at the same time as the w. And we had nine out of the 12 Olympians that on the 96 team playing in the A BL. And it was actually better competition. Was it? Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And then we all went to the WNBA when we, um, when the lethal actually, the competition was so good that the, the CBA agreement for the nine nine season put a limit on how many a BL players could be on the team. I didn't know that. Okay. Yeah. Because it was gonna displace a lot of current WNBA players. Okay. Um, and I was, and throughout my whole career, I was always a double figure scorer. And so I get to WNBA my first year in the Detroit, and all of a sudden depression hits I have. And it came, I was struggling with bouncing back from mistakes. I was struggling with performance anxiety. I was struggling, um, with overanalyzing every single thing. And I was on and off the um. Injured reserve for, for depression. Uh, I remember my coach at the time, Nancy Lieber and Klein would look down, um, at me to come in the game and I would, I would shake my head, no, I can't do it. And I've never, that's never happened to me before. During the season. I've had bounce of depression, you know, situational depression, like when I got cut from the. 95 national team. I went to a, a short stint of depression, but never, the game was never a part of the game was making me sad, right? That's never happened before. Normally basketball would take me outta sadness, you know, let's go ball basketball's making me sad. And so the season ended and then 2000 came between this, between 99 and 2000 came and I was like, I can't play this next season. It's too much. And I never, and I, and I took that season off and got treated for a depression and just couldn't imagine balling. I just, the game that I love was making me sad. Yeah. That was the, it was the weirdest thing. Like I didn't want to touch a ball. I didn't wanna look at a ball, nothing. And so I never talked about why I didn't play. In the newspaper that, you know, back then they put personal reasons. Yeah. But I didn't tell anybody until about six years ago on TikTok, I did a video about why I took that season off. And so, um, I was embarrassed. I felt weak. I felt mentally weak. You know, as athletes, we're not supposed to show any weakness and we're supposed to play through anything. You know, you get an, you sprain your ankle, walk it off. Yeah, and I, I couldn't walk this off. Yeah. The, the reason I ask you, I, I kind of had a feeling, and I appreciate you so much for sharing and, and the vulnerability that comes with it is I went through that I high school, I had a, uh, three, four month stretch of depression where I, I, it was almost like paralysis. It was almost like I knew exactly what to do, and then I got on the floor and my body couldn't do it. This wasn't talking to my brain, wasn't talking to the rest of. Body parts. And then, you know, I, I got over it a little bit, got to college and we had a coaching change and all of a sudden it came back again and it just, it crushed me. It was like the thing that gave me life was Yeah. Was hurting me. You know what I mean? Yeah, exactly. And I, and it bothered me so much and it still bothers me today. And I, and I love talking to coaches like you and former players like you went through it. Because I, I don't want any kid to go through that. I don't want any kid to feel that way. What are some of those things that you've learned from those experiences that you share with boys and girls today in a, in a preventative medicine way? Yeah, because, excuse me, for me. When I think about when I started to struggles, when I started questioning who I was as a player, my confidence, yeah, I didn't have the skills, um, to combat that. I went to, even went to a sports psychologist. I was totally unhelpful. Um, I also, um, mistakes I would just hold onto them and like re replay the mistakes over and over and over in my head. When I'm on the bench after the game, um, I could have a good game, but I only saw the negative that was happening. Like what? What? I didn't just say what was going well, what, you know, how, what did I do well this game? What are the good things? And we saw the bad things, right? Um, performance anxiety. I put a lot of pressure on myself. I had these high expectations to perform. If I didn't make, meet those expectations, then I was. Then I had failed. And perfectionism, that was another big thing. I had to be perfect. And, um, I wanted to be devout white that of, of, that I was playing be that I had, that I was before and not just staying in a here and now and beca I was more outcome focused than process focused staying in the moment. And that will definitely, um, lead to anxiety or performance anxiety. Was it a challenge for you?'cause you were California Player of the year, all American Aller, you know, national Champion. National champion. Was the success a part of that too? Did that, that was that added weight on you? Oh yeah. You walked to every gym you walked into. You were supposed to be the best player. Yeah, that was added weight. Um. It is, it's more of you think about, and also what was in my mind as well is that I, I know I, when I told you about just now, when I didn't make the 95 team. Yeah. Um, that was in the back of my mind too. Um, am I good enough? I didn't make this team. It was, I know it was four years later, but I was still questioning who I was as an athlete. That was, that not making that team was a pivotal point in my. My career as a basketball player, not because I, I got cut. It's because I was promised to make that team and I didn't make it. And my college coach was the coach of that team. And for some reason that just threw me and I, I, because none of it made sense. Yeah. But I didn't have the right mentality if I had the right mentality, you know? Um, not letting anything shake your confidence. Um, someone's opinion. Control the controllables. If I had the right mentality, I, I, I would've, um, addressed it differently. And, and it's called, um, it's a term called cognitive appraisal, and it, it is more around anxiety getting ready for, you know, if you have anxiety for, for a game, athletes who look at like nerves as something great. Perform better than athletes that look like nerves as something that's gonna hinder them. If I would've looked at me getting cut from that team as, um, okay, someone cut me, I'm gonna try again next time, but instead I looked at it as someone cut me, I'm less than, yeah. They think, they think, they've basically say, my career is over there. I'm not good enough. Yeah, I'm not. And so I, it just that, that affected me for years. And I never really talked through it with anybody. I just buried it. I can relate to all of that. Um, I'm gonna, I'm gonna come at this question a couple different ways. I, I, this, I'm really curious about this. Could your teammates have helped you through that part of your career? Differently. Could they have had a positive effect to what you were going through and how they could have handled you differently and been your friend differently? Yeah. If I let them in, no one knew that I was going through that. Only people, maybe my parents and my sister. That was it. No one I, I remember, um, I think I was playing for Minnesota and Tara's sister, Heidi. Was an assistant coach and I, I mentioned it, how it affected me. She kind of, she kind of laughed like that. I don't think she, I don't know how to put it. She kind of like, uh, she didn't realize that it was, it affected me so heavily, so no. She took it as a throw off statement, like, yeah, yeah. Like it was, I remember her just. And but that hit my heart. Yeah, it really did. And I felt so betrayed. I mean, come find out years later, it was, um, basically the Olympic committee's choice. But, um, that feeling betrayed by your own coach hits you, hits you different. Yeah. Because vir. Being Olympic coach is, she's there because of things that I did in college. Yeah. Not just me, I mean people that played with me. You know, we were national champions twice that, that you're, that's why, one of the reasons why you're a coach of the Olympic team. So I'm feeling, I'm not feeling she owed, owed me, but I'm feeling like there should been some loyalty. That's how I felt betrayed in that moment back then. Right. It is completely understandable to feel that way. All right, let's, let's, let's turn the tables a little bit. You've got a 18-year-old in your office or over Zoom. They're going through something similar, great player, but they're feeling, feeling like they can't perform, they can't get through the obstacle that's, that's happening in their brain and their, and their body. Where do we start? Well first we start with, um, I have a sports psych assessment that I put them through. Um, I form, it's called the Athlete Coping Skills Inventory. So it measures anxiety, avail ability to perform on the pressure coachability, confidence focus, and then I have another. Um, assessment where I just ask them questions about, um, their career and how they respond to different situations or social approval. A lot of kids are playing for their parents, not for themselves. So it starts there because a lot of times you think it's one thing. And then you take this assessment as something totally different. And then we come into the the zoom room, and then I'm asking questions based on that triangulation, not just taking answers from what they said and taking at face value, asking them more. And most athletes that come into my practice perform like. Amazing in practice. And then they get to the games, they're like, who are you? And that's so common. I've been there too. Yep, me too. And it stems from, um, feeling free in practice, feeling free not to make mistakes. You know, feeling freedom to make mistakes and then going into games depending on who they play for.'cause a lot of, some of these coaches pull you up their mistakes. Some of these coaches. Allow you to play through mistakes, and then in the games feeling, not feeling that freedom. And so my job is to get them to feel that freedom, that carefree when they're playing. And when players are in the zone, they're more their process focused. They're in a moment, they're, they don't care about the outcome. They're carefree. Um. Time slows down or speeds up, but they, it, it, they're enjoying it. So getting athletes to enjoy the process while they're playing in the game and not focus on the outcome.'cause when you, like I said before, when you are on the outcome, that creates anxiety, that creates extra pressure, that creates expectations. And playing without, without that and playing free. And I know you, you, you probably had the experience when you're in a game. You just feel like the basket's super big and you don't care about the score, and you are just out there in the moment and you, it is not about win or lose, it's just enjoying the process. That's where we want everybody to be in and, and there's no better place to be in when you're on the basketball court when you get there, right? Yeah. It's, it's, it's repeating it and, and understanding it and having the significance of it. What are some of the tools you teach? Just give our audience a little taste here.'cause a lot of our audience are parents with athletes. Um, give them a little taste of like a tool or two that you would give a young athlete to help them kind of get through the mess that goes in our heads sometimes before a game, before a contest. To kind of help them get ready to jump into that zone because you really have to be playing. I mean, you have to be in the flow of a game to be in that zone. You can't, I don't. Is it possible to get there before that? Um, well first of all, there's some sports psychologist like Kim Revisa that is like. He, he started out his career, well, he's passed away, but he's, he's a legend. He started as with, with baseball. He started out his career trying to get athletes in the zone and then he all the flow flow state. Right. And then he realized it is, it is rare and athletes have to get used to being uncomfortable while they're uncomfortable. Okay. And playing through adversity. And so. Where athletes struggle is that when they hit that speed bump, they don't know what to do. And so one thing I teach, and it's, I mean, it's nothing groundbreaking. It is, um, a reset routine when you hit those speed bumps, when you make that turnover or when you running the lap, when you're track running, you don't get your negative split. Um, it's a reset word that means something to you, like, um, confident or free. Take a deep breath in a physical motion and it's forgotten. You have to have, like Ted Lasso says the mind of a goldfish. That's right. Right. You have to have, and, and you have to remember your failures like a goldfish. And remember your successes like an elephant. Um, people always say elephants have great, um. Right. So that's one tool. Um, bounce it back from mistakes. That's, that's one thing that athletes struggle with the most. Another tool that I use a lot and which is underrated, is visualization. Your brain doesn't know the difference between you doing something in real life or you imagining it the same areas they, they did a functional MRI on the brain and the same areas that light up when you imagine yourself shooting a jump shot or the same areas that light up when you shoot the actual jump shot. So visualization is powerful. I give my clients, um, personalized guided visualizations that I record based on what they need. Um, I also pair visualization with affirmations, so they sit affirmation and they visualize the affirmation. I do a lot of breath work, calming yourself breathing, taking deep breaths, um, even in the middle of high stakes, um, pressure situations, coming back to your breath as a way to center yourself and be present moment focused. You know, I've seen so many of your posts coach where it, it's almost too simple. But I hope parents will go to your, your Instagram and, and watch your videos because there's so many things you can give your kid just that, that three seconds of breathing, you know, those. Yeah, those three deep breaths or, or how we talk to ourselves using that, that word, using that phrase, those things are so powerful. You know, we, we give kids too much and it just adds to that anxiety sometimes. So that's what I love about the way you coach mental performance. You, you don't want your kids overthinking. You want'em to understand you missed the shot, you didn't run as fast as you normally have. All right, let's get ba it. Let's, let's move on to the next one. So I, I love how you do that. Thank you. Talk to me a little bit about where identity plays in this, in this world we're talking about and, and how Yeah. How we see ourselves and who we are that we see. We look in the mirror. Yeah. Identity is key. Um, that's something I struggle with, you know, my. I didn't play well then, you know, that's basketball is who I was. Right. You know, when I, when I retired from the game, it was, it was another depth for me. Like I, I mourned for I don't know how many years because my whole identity was around myself as a basketball player. And so I, and this is hard, this is a lot of work when an athlete comes in and. Their sport is who they are. And I try to tell them, well, I tell them, it's what you do. It's not who you are. So let's talk about what your values are. What are your values? Who, you know, what, who are you outside the lines? What, what do you do? Well, besides I'm a good water polo player. Who am I when, you know, if they take water polo away? And um, that's. Those are things that a lot of people, kids never thought about. They never thought about it, and, and it's key to really think about who you are in as a person, not who you are as, as the athlete. Isn't that the truth? You know, I'm, I'm like, you, you know, you're only in your thirties, but I'm in my fifties, but I'm Oh, you, you, you choking right? I am, I'm teasing. I'll do her say thank you. You, you just look a lot younger than I do. Uh, you look great, coach. Um, thanks. When you, when you think about that identity, I, I'm, how do we get kids to understand their love of the game?'cause you, you talked about kids that play, play for their parents and maybe they don't realize that they do love the game. But they're, they're playing in a way where they're always thinking about, is mom and dad gonna be happy? How do we get them to understand what they love and, and why it's important to them and, and help them make that decision on whether they wanna keep playing? Yeah. Those are tough conversations, especially those are the conversations where parents get mad, mad at me. Because, um, we're, we're almost working. They bring the kid for one thing and then they find out maybe my daughter is not as happy playing her sport as we thought she was, and she's only doing it for me. Yeah. Um, that's hard. That's, and as a coach, I still struggle with that. I'm still learning how to, um, manage that, um, with, with young people because I, I want them to play forever, but if it's making them. Sad it was causing friction in the household. Are they dreading going to games? Maybe this, this isn't what's best for them right now. Maybe they need to pull on Alyssa Lou retire and then Yeah. You know, come back. Yes. I was just, I was just gonna, I was just gonna piggyback that thought'cause it's almost like it's our job as coaches that sometimes we have to, we have to create the separation. Playing that sport can't be with mom and dad. You know, mom and dad could be nowhere in the vicinity of making that decision. And once we separate that and we take that away or let them take it away, all of a sudden they realize, man, I miss it. I miss my teammates. I miss running. I miss the competition. And they remember why they started in the first place and where that joy comes from. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Joy. And it's, it's sad to see a, a, a young player that doesn't have that joy Right. Hurts. It hurts us watching. Yeah. Yeah. Um, it's, it's, it's so good stuff. I, I coach Val, I hope anybody's listening and if anybody's got a child that's doing really well or maybe struggling with their sport, I hope they'll follow you. I hope they'll reach out to you and connect with you. Because I think where you come from being one of one of the great college players of all time, you know, and, and being somebody that played at such a high level and, and, but people not understanding what you were going through during some of those years before and after, and, and you bring such great perspective to a young person and you bring, such as a mother, you bring such great perspective to a parent on. Sometimes we, we have to separate, we have to take a step back. We have to say, okay, let's, let's, let's give, let's give this a break for a little bit. So I hope people will, will reach out to you and talk to you and, and, and use your perspective and advice. I wanna do a little rapid fire with you before we wrap up and we'll get into the second segment and kind of talk about the mental side of recruiting a little bit. But I wanna do some fun ones with you, if you don't mind. Uh, get to know you a little bit better. Who's your favorite teammate you ever played with and why? Oh gosh, that's a hard one. Who's that favorite teammate and why? If you had to go back and play again and start a team, who would you want with you? Who would be your first? Um, I would say Sonya Henning. No one You pro? She played at Stanford. Yeah. I remember signing. Um, she was just always a calming force out there. Like I never, I never saw her rattled. And then if you needed to talk to your coach about something, she was, and she's, she's, she went to law school. She was your attorney. She was your spokesperson. That's correct. Uh, we, we all need that teammate, don't we? Um, what's the best advice you received as a player? Hmm. There's so many things I've heard. I'm probably gonna think about this tonight when I sleep and gonna give you one answer and then like, oh, I should have said best, best advice. I don't know. I can't even remember that advice. It's been, it is like 87 years ago, Matt. I know. I'm with you. Think about that. Well, let's, let's look at it this way. Like I said, I just love watching you play. It's, I could do, I could do post technique videos on teaching kids how to play the post the right way. Is there something your dad taught you or a coach taught you coming up that you're like, gosh, I'm, that helped me do this, that helped me become this? Um, one thing I, my dad always just playing with men never let, allowed me to be, I wasn't afraid of being physical. Yeah. I, I never backed down from physicality probably. Would've been longer playing my back wouldn't hurt so much if I weren't so physical. But, um, I think that was, that was it. Always never back down and be afraid of the physicality. I, I've got the bad back. That's why I'm laughing. And I've got a fake tooth.'cause I, my dad had me playing at age 12 with men in men's leagues. And you lost the tooth at age 12? Yeah, I was 12. Yeah, I think it was 12. 12, maybe 13. But I was, but I was playing in a men's league. I picked this guy's pocket two or three times and scored on him a couple of times, and he got a rebound and I grabbed a rebound and he threw his elbow and oh gosh, he, he's my brother. My, both my brothers and my dad were playing in that game, and he's lucky he survived. He walked outta that gym. They were so mad at him. But, um, that. I tell kids all the time, find an old man, old woman's league and go play. Go play with those people because they get it. You know? They're not wasting any energy. They're not wasting any movement. They're gonna teach you how to play the game the right way, physical. So I love that. I just love that your dad did that for you. You might have hated it at the time, but I love it. I sure did. I did. Tell me about favorite music. If you could go see any concert right now, what would you go see? I like gospel music. I, I'm a follower of Jesus, so any music that's gospel, that's uplifting, get me hyped up, praising the Lord. Um, various artists. I like gospel rap as well. I, I work out to that. Give me a favorite Lecrae. Um, he's been around for a minute. L-E-C-R-A-E. Okay. Um, very cool. My oldest one thinks snow is cheesy, but he's coming around. All right. I love it. All right, I'll, I'll play a little music when I post all your stuff on Instagram next week. So I like to, I like to play the music you like, um, one thing every young female athlete needs to hear right now. You are enough. You are more than enough, and. Talk to yourself like you're talking to your best friend. Love that. I'm gonna, I'm gonna have that conversation with my 16-year-old daughter tonight. Where are you located? I'm in the Denver area. Oh, okay. I used to live in Southern California, but we, we moved to Denver about 12 years ago. Talk to yourself like your, your best friend. Love that. That's real. Yeah. I, I always tell kids, um, what if you walked around with a loud speaker on your brain and everybody could hear your thoughts? Would, would, would they be shocked or, you know, amazed. So I just think about that when you're talking to yourself. Would you be inspiring them or would they be worried about you? Yeah. Thank you. That's it. I love that. I just love that. Um. When it's all said and done, coach, what do you want your impact on athletes to be? Um, I want athletes that I've worked with and look back and say that Coach Val, not, not only changed my play, but changed how I look at life and helped me, gave me life skills that I could be a successful human being.'cause everybody's not gonna go on to. Play college sports. Everybody's not gonna even go on to play professionally. But how are you operating when you're, when the sport is over? How are you treating others? Are you, maybe things I've said you're telling your teammates. I, I, I wanna, I wanna leave a legacy somehow. And which is why I started that, um, that mentally strong her academy because I, I wanted to make mental performance coaching more accessible. Financially to people. And I wanted to create a community of female athletes, um, who are trying to do the same thing in their mental game and, and perform at their best. So yeah, I, I wanted to grow into a big community and people make connections and get mentors out of it, all of that. If I can ever help with that community in any way, I'd love to be a part of it. Love to share. But thank you so much for doing this. Thank you so much for being who you are and, and giving of yourself in a way that's so important for young people to hear your story and and hear what you've learned. And I'm thankful you shared your wisdom with us today. So thank you. Make sure if you're listening, come back on Monday. We're gonna get into the recruiting side with Coach Val, but thanks for doing this, coach. Thank you. Thanks for having Matt. You just heard the end of a really important conversation with the great Val Whiting. I'm so thankful for her honesty and humility and willingness to share parts of her journey that were not easy to talk about. Too many athletes struggle with their confidence and depression or simply figuring out who they are outside of their sport. Val's story is proof that even the very best. Athletes on the planet can go through those same battles. Young athletes need to know they're not alone. Struggling does not make them weak. There are people who care. There are tools that can help, and there are ways to build the mental skills needed to perform with more confidence and joy. If you know someone who needs to hear this episode, please share it with them. Comment below with your thoughts and subscribe. See, do not miss part two on Monday where Val and I tackle the mental side of college recruiting. And as always, you can find more resources, books, blogs, and recruiting support@coachmattrogers.com. Until next time, stay focused on what you can control. Stay humble and keep chasing significance.